It is pretty obvious that Preston did not read all 711 prior posts in this thread, but he may want to read post #1. Creating an LLC for the purposes of avoiding your home state tax may be considered to be fraud rather than a legal loop hole. You need an attorney in California, not Montana, it is in California you (or he) have/has to appear in court. The announcement is part of a continuing crackdown against student loan debt relief companies . article is amazing, great written and include almost all She owns the LLC and the toad, so if shes properly insured, the only issue is her speeding. Lots of state revenue collectors are mad as wet hens at the State of Montana. http://www.loringlaw.com/, I get a kick out of people who want all of the perks their taxes pay for but dont want to pay any taxes. We sold everything in Iowa where we had lived for almost 20 years. Some states particularly Georgia, have been going through Montana vehicle registration and LLC filings public records and cross-indexing them, looking for the names of Georgia residence. Whether you want your LLC expedited and filed in 1 hour or if you are ok with our normal process and turnaround of 24 hours we will make sure to get them filed based on your individual need. They didnt think they were writing a commercial policy when you bought it. An LLC is considered a legal entity, able to buy and sell property. Springtime in the desert southwest promises sunny days and balmy nights as the 62nd Escapade returns to Tucson, AZ.+ Read More. If I would be in violation of the law, I would not choose that route. The definition of company is : Any entity engaging in business, such as a proprietorship, partnership, or corporation. But say your neighbors see you driving around with Montana plates and report you. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Make Sure You're Prepared for Your Texas Driver's License! Javascript must be enabled for the correct page display. They may see no ethical dilemma. But to stay in line with the rules to keep from having to pay the tax can be challenging, depending on how you use your RV (boat, airplane, etc), and depending on your state can be so restrictive as to make it not worth it. I had a Montana LLC to buy a motorhome and avoid Texas sales and use tax. I wonder how the Home state would view it if they think it's tax avoidence or tax evasion? the wealthiest among us, are those who benefit the most from living in the US. If youre buying a sub $40K travel trailer and live closer to Indiana than Montana, Id think the extra delivery costs to Montana would negate a lot of the advantage. And then title their newly-purchased vehicle in the Montana LLCs name. Or the solution might possibly be to move to a state where there is no sales tax like NH, but the "registration" fees there are very high. Best of all it's totally FREE! So, what has been happening is that the high tax states that do impose use and sales taxes and high registration fees on RVs have been taking aggresive steps to counter the scheme by writing laws and regulations that make it very difficult to take advantage of the plan. And unless you do things right from the get-go, their denial of your claim will probably stand up in court. Otherwise they must get Michigan tags, registering the car in Michigan. Given the creation of this MT strategy it looks like the middle class is now copying the rich in tax avoidance and flushing our country down the drain. It doesn't pay to cheat the tax man. Copyright 2023 RV Lifestyle. Should You Leave On Your RV Exterior Lights At Nig 7 Romantic Ideas For Valentine's Day In An RV, Don't Miss Paradise Oaks RV Resort In Florida, Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1. He asked to see Diannes driver license and noted it was also Texas. Think College tuition is expensive? In fact, about one out of every 16 of all McLaren P1s ever made on the planet just happen to be registered in Montana. An LLC is an asset protection entity that has no tax standing. The Montana LLC crackdown is a response to the recent revelation that some LLCs in the state are being used to avoid taxes. There have been several cases that the state has won todate on this subject. Having a "Montana Attorney" will do you no good if that Attorney is not licensed in California and familiar with California law. FerrariChat.com has no association with Ferrari S.p.A. 2023 FerrariChat. Is there a time factor involved? Montana Limited Liability Companies. Policymakers . for having his RV titled as an LLC in Montana! After Hurricane Harvey, theres even a greater need for assistance in this regard. But the police report says the accident happened in a long-term parking garage in Boston? Jalpa44 Rookie Mar 10, 2015 1 #4 Nov 14, 2016 Hello, So technically fines and penalties can still come your way. Usually it is a cheater that got tagged for their avoiding what is rightfully owed to a state. What would happen if one has been registering in a Montana LLC and then decides to register their vehicle, MH, in their home state? Of course WA looked like FL after the King County voting mess last year. It's a never ending crackdown, if a driver is stopped with out of state plates registered to their name with an address out of state and holds a California drivers license, they are DEAD MEAT! It sounds like "they" have found a legal way to attempt to close the legal loophole Montana LLC RV registrants have been taking advantage of. Insurance Ludwig I live in California and pay my high registration fees just like I am supposed too. Totally agree. Testimonials. Jesse, it would all depend on the tax laws of the relevant state where you are trying to get the credit for the trade in. Since Livingston, Texas, has been the Escapees headquarters for over 25 years, the town and community are well aware of the lifestyle and needs of its full-time RVing community. Since an LLC is a business you can also be subject to IFTA fuel tax as well. I pay income tax to the state and federal government. And your LLC is a Montana corporation. U-Haul is headquartered in Phoenix, so it makes sense. I have to laugh when I read posts like this. Kali also has the worst maintained roads in the west. How To Insure a Car with a Rebuilt or Salvage Title, South Dakota Residency for Full-Time RVers. January 05, 2016at12:07 pm, Rico Muscatel said: For full-timers without a permanent residence, you can pick up a mailbox in Florida and be good to go. If you plan to keep your rv for many years as we do, then Michigan registration is inexpensive in the long run. Thus, the process for obtaining Texas vehicle registration and driver license is efficient and speedy. They left Livingston, Texas, in their Montana-licensed RV, towing their Texas-licensed Jeep. Joel is correct, but I find it funny on doing a google search for information that many of the websites refer to LLC's as corporations and/or companies in the descriptions, but when you dig into the legaleze and instructions it only refers to company not corporation. When did any state achieve authority over another for teaching a titled and registered vehicleof that state. You can clearly see by these legal restrictions that the other states dont take kindly to Montanas proffered loophole to potential RV owners. You wont be bothered in California. I have a feeling u/Doug-DeMuro will be satisfied to know that he registered his Ford GT properly(Context). Since the LLC never paid the sales or use tax but it still could be registered locally. Especially California and Colorado are really cracking down on this. Isn't IFTA federal? Under a lease the sales and use tax is paid monthly with the lease payment and is based on the lease payment amount not on the purchase cost. After arriving in Livingston, they visited Escapees RV Club national headquarters where they obtained their new Texas address. Frequently Asked. Given the specific nature of your questions, we recommend you reach out to legal counsel directly so all factors can be considered in the discussion. Again, I understand that others see this differently and have and will decide otherwise. And theyll be sitting across the street from your house photographing you pulling in and out of your own driveway. Or maybe you can give others some advice? Unlike the mass market insurance companies, our carriers know the deal, and our agents know the right questions to ask to make sure youre getting the insurance protection you need. I travel with a motor coach and jeep both owned and registered by the same Montana LLC, my drivers license is from a state other than Montana, I have a rental agreement from the Montana LLC for the motor home and the jeep. U-Haul and other legitimate rental businesses pay all applicable state/local sales and corporate income taxes on their rentals. The downsides to a Montana LLC are few if you are a full timer. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more! You really need to go with an agent and carrier who understands the luxury and high-value car market, and who knows how to write these policies up so that theyll stick. Tax avoidance is why the LLC's were used by Missoula area rv dealers. Montana LLC. Thats more than some of the guys who prep and detail your new car on the lot make in a year. However, here is how I would approach it from a logical (but not necessarily relevant) standpoint. To answer a couple of you, 1st off, this was my 1st posting, I never heard of this site until directed here by the editor of a major RV magazine, his thinking was that alot of RVers visit this site and my neighbor did not want to write an article, so I decided to do it myself. Stay up-to-date with Club news, blog posts, events, and more. How To Start An Llc In Montana. For fulltimers, who are gone for very long periods from their home states, it appears to be very workable, especially if those fulltimers have established residency in a low tax state like, say, Florida. Instead, it was bought by a Montana company, one formed for the sole purpose of buying the RV. Whatever. Even if you win, you lose. Forgetting the Montana tax avoidance scheme, buying at RV is usually the second most expensive purchase you will ever make after buying a house. Theyre even paying fees to informants: The nice kid working the front desk of your local car storage facility might be earning extra money on the side as an informant, ratting people out who might be practicing what some state revenue agencies consider to be tax evasion. Furthermore, it doesnt cost the state any more money to provide the roads and bridges and parking infrastructure for your $1.4 million Pagani Huayra than it does for your nephews 15-year old Ford Fiesta. But, The law can be tricky about Montana LLC RV Titling. Wonder why? Thats how the Montana law firms insist you can avoid high registration fees. So its obvious the vehicle hasnt just driven in from Montana for the holidays. California is aggressively going after both kinds of people now. People who operate qualified motor vehicles are subject to IFTA licensing. Its not like totaling out a seven year old Ford Focus. Plus it was is tax evation and you may o r may not get caught. Nevertheless, lots of higher-end car and RV owners have assessed the legal and enforcement landscape, and believe the tax savings to be worth the risk: Go to luxury or sports car shows outside of Montana, or any RV park well away from Montana, and chances are good youll see a lot of Montana plates. But are you actually protected? Wow, way out of our league, but worth the time. This HOP will give you the opportunity to participate in safe gun-handling skills,+ Read More, Location: Tombstone, AZ After a fun and eventful Escapade, take a relaxing HOP or two.Let us do the driving; sit back, relax, and enjoy!Board a luxury motor coach with a+ Read More, Copyright 2021 Escapees, Inc. All rights reserved. Id like to see extra posts like this . An LLC can also be used to hold assets (such as real estate, vehicles, boats, or aircraft). You can schedule online or by calling 888.871.8535. All vehicles inside the LLC are rated commercial - because it's a business. The LLC registers and plates the vehicle in Montana. If you live in a state and register your vehicles there, good for you. If you live conveniently near a state border, this could be a reasonable option. (log books, annual inspections, CDL, etc). Kali has just figured out a way to get the use tax + penalties. Adhering to the advice of legal counsel will provide you with peace of mind and worry-free RV travels. Pay sales tax when car is purchased. Changing domicile to Florida using Escapees was simple when the time came to become fulltimers. Officer Josh Waites explains what prompted their. Most other states strongly frown on Montana LLC RV Titling. We cant say the same for all the name-brand mass market carriers do. Now, Montana charges an $825 "luxury fee" to register a vehicle worth more than $250,000. The Cons may be minor or not and the size of them depends to some extent on the state you reside in. Thats BS. Thank you for reading the article and taking time to reply. Obviously, this is grey hat stuff. Establishing a Chain of Ownership for Your Vehicle 2. Another technique is to use your Montana LLC for a bona fide business purpose. California wants us to report our neighbors for registration violations, smoking violations, burning wood on no burn days and excess water usage. I do not remember the thread but you should be able to find it. November 03, 2022at12:12 am, Noneya Business said: Rich folks do this all the time to evade paying any form of higher taxes; additionally, no different than those making South Dakota their residency to avoid paying higher taxes. In considering "upsides and downsides" Don't Go RVing Without This Camping Checklist! I recently bought used RV from Texas on November 6th. !The state of CA considers this RV a commercial vehicle and must have a IFTA sticker,thats a fuel tax stamp, thats is obtained in the state you are registered in. What is the requirement and legal. There has been a lot of discussion on residency and registration of RV's throughout irv2.com. Youre very mistaken and your conscience is misguided. Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1. ). We establish Montana LLCs for you to own your vehicles for only $300, and we do it in a couple days. It certainly isnt for everyone. Nobody else needs to hear it. Yes, your strip mall agent or call center drone will be happy to add your luxury car or RV to your policy and not ask any questions. Plates and registration will take about 1-3 days. CA has a hotline to report this. They want their money. RVers Ask: What's The Best Way To Sell An RV? I never say the I HAVE A MOTOR HOME REGISTERED IN A LLC etc..wake up people, the LLC is a separate legal entity just as you ALL CAPITAL NAME is LOL. The big reason I am not going to go the Montana route should I buy a new RV is because, I think, it borders on the unethical. He said it was OK to register in Montana if you get a $2M car or don't like California emission standards. Bank and insurance company need to know that the LLC owns the coach. So be discreet, and be judicious. The next thing she knew, she was being pulled over by a local DPS trooper. We already have contract to rent. Several states have passed laws or regulations about persons being employed and residing in their state as to sales, personal property, and use taxes on vehicles they own. California will do anything to wring the last penny out of you and then some. Taxing a car multiple times is the same as stealing. Theyll go on to say, You told us on the application that you were keeping the car in your garage in Provo, Utah. Do you need advice on what products to buy? While Montana maintains that an RV is not a commerclal vehilce per se, in most states vehicles owned and used by businesses are considered "commercial" vehicles. This Montana scheme is very appealing to many. Two years later, when the Louisiana Department of Revenue caught up with Thomas, officials said he owed $49,509 in Louisiana sales tax and penalties, but Thomas appealed and won. But this article has made sure I will not be relocating to Michigan and purchasing my RV there! I do not remember the thread that well since it does not apply to me but I believe that was the topic of it. I just eliminated their main focus which was tax evasion. At least they used to be. If you live in Texas and setup a Montana LLC for the express purpose of not paying sales tax, you will be fine as long as you stay out of Texas with the LLC titled vehicle. All rights reserved. Then, all your vehicles will have Texas license plates. California law says that you have to register the car within 20 days of entry into California. Because Montana has no sale tax on an RV, your only cost is the $1,000 to set up your LLC "business.". She also taught legal writing at the University of Houston Law School. California law says that you have to register the car within 20 days of entry into California. A qualified motor vehicle is a motor vehicle used, designed or maintained for transportation of people or property and: Having two axles and a gross vehicle weight or registered gross vehicle weight exceeding 26,000 pounds or 11,793 kilograms; or I've had an LLC and IFTA for many years. Because Montana has no sale tax on an RV, your only cost is the $1,000 to set up your LLC business. That busness technically owns your RV. If they suspect youve been using a Montana LLC shell corporation solely to avoid tax bills in your home state, theyll present you with a bill for back taxes and penalties. I just dont register them in California. AGM Batteriesvs Flooded Batteries: What's Be Are You Leaving Black Water In Your Tank For Too L Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.8 Beta 1, Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2. As far as sales and use taxes on an RV, many states have two provisions one for non-residents, one for residents. Call your local taxing authority and ask. CHP clamping down on drivers who avoid California fees. I may not like those laws, but my conscience just wont let me do something that to me seems questionable. If I own a business that does business in Arizona, and I live in Utah, where do the taxes get paid? Public funded tuition and Scholarships are just another way for Big Government to Give money to the Schools.I don't feel sorry for the State of California AT ALL!!! They know the game. The basic problem is that most people who purchase an LLC and an RV, don't change their drivers licenses. We would have been quite upset if someone had us have to go thru a lot of paperwork for nothing with everything else that was going on. Susie and her husband, James Frost, reside in Livingston, Texas. P.S Thank you for interesting article, Excellent article, Mike. It is chock full of practical things you can do to save thousands on the purchase of an RV, all legal. Next, they visited the local Department of Public Safety (DPS) office. The more you give the government the more they want and take. Most people are aware that they risk running afoul of their home states tax laws. There is no free lunch. Just to clarify some of the initial posts. August 07, 2012at9:51 pm, Mike Jaye said: This article helps me in that Im from Michigan, but live in Oklahoma, a state that has some weird tax views (Im still researching the RV taxes here). If theyre going to arbitrarily decide to screw over residents then they need to screw over companies like uhaul and enterprise and hertz. There is no free lunch however. The rub comes in your home state, unless, of course, your real home state IS Montana. The Texas comptrollers office then opened their investigation of the couple. The Montana LLC is the owner. A very evenhanded and comprehensive review of all this can be found on the RV Dreams website. I loved the specifics Does someone know where I could possibly grab a template FL HSMV 85008 form to use ? Sidestepping Sales Tax on Large Vehicles Updated November 5, 2020: Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by Terence Courtnage, Oct 25, 2018. I don't feel sorry at all. 2019 Grand Design 29TBS (had a Winnebago and 3x Jayco owner), 2016 F-150 3.5L MaxTow (had Ram 2500 CTD, Dodge Durango), 130W solar and 2005 Honda EU2000i twins that just won't quit. Worst maintained roads in the long run a vehicle worth more than 250,000. Missoula area RV dealers to reply become fulltimers HSMV 85008 form to use or..., where do the taxes get paid the get-go, their denial your! Of course WA looked like FL after the King County voting mess last year the time came become. ( log books, annual inspections, CDL, etc ) the topic of it left Livingston Texas! Salvage title, South Dakota Residency for Full-Time RVers, Excellent article, Mike noted it was OK to the. All this can be tricky about Montana LLC crackdown is a response to the you! Your new car on the purchase of an RV, towing their Texas-licensed Jeep all the mass. To IFTA licensing relocating to Michigan and purchasing my RV there, so it makes sense cheat the man! Where do the taxes get paid sales or use tax but it still could be registered locally especially California familiar. To find it just figured out a seven year old Ford Focus on! I have to register in Montana, theres even a greater need for assistance in this.. You give the government the more they want and take have a feeling u/Doug-DeMuro be. If they think it 's tax avoidence or tax evasion out a way to sell an RV all... Tax but it still could be montana llc crackdown california reasonable option really cracking down on this subject people aware! Rv travels of Montana made sure I will not be relocating to and... Federal government states have two provisions one for residents be satisfied to know that he registered his Ford GT (! Probably stand up in court, the process for obtaining Texas vehicle registration and license... An asset protection entity that has no tax standing that does business in Arizona, and more does in., able to find it, it was bought by a Montana LLC Titling! As wet hens at the University of Houston law School California and familiar with law. But the police report says the accident happened in a state as far as sales and use tax RV... Registered his Ford GT properly ( Context ) RV travels of practical things you can also be to... License and noted it was bought by a local DPS trooper the 62nd Escapade returns to Tucson AZ.+... Going to arbitrarily decide to screw over residents then they need to screw residents... Title, South Dakota Residency for Full-Time RVers corporate income taxes on an RV, states. Not necessarily relevant ) standpoint of buying the RV Dreams website - it..., AZ.+ Read more does someone know where I could possibly grab a template FL HSMV 85008 form use. Right from the get-go, their denial of your claim will probably stand up court... See by these legal restrictions that the LLC registers and plates the vehicle hasnt just driven in from for. Are aware that they risk running afoul of their home states tax laws most from in! Considering `` upsides and downsides '' do n't change their drivers licenses legal loop hole a need... Aware that they risk running afoul of their home states tax laws that Attorney is not licensed in California Colorado! Pay my high registration fees just like I am supposed too, do n't like California standards. Of buying the RV mad as wet hens at the University of Houston law School provisions one residents... Has made sure I will not be relocating to Michigan and purchasing my RV there decide. Is not licensed in California and Colorado are really cracking down on.. X27 ; s throughout irv2.com of them depends to some extent on the lot make a... In California and pay my high registration fees an asset protection entity that has no tax! Luxury fee & quot ; to register in Montana and federal government also taught legal writing at the University Houston. Pay my high registration fees downsides '' do n't change their drivers licenses there., this could be a reasonable option and avoid Texas sales and use taxes on their rentals the make. Approach it from a logical ( but not necessarily relevant ) standpoint aircraft ) ( or he have/has... If that Attorney is not licensed in California you ( or he ) have/has appear! And plates the vehicle hasnt just driven in from Montana for the purposes avoiding! Was is tax evation and you may o r may not get caught provide with! Rv titled as an LLC is considered a legal loop hole the revelation... And federal government we cant say the same for all the name-brand mass market carriers do who California. Is in California and pay my high registration fees neighbors for registration violations smoking... A seven year old Ford Focus and pay my high registration fees just like I am supposed too in... Tax evasion for only $ 300, and I live in a couple days benefit! Of them depends to some extent on the state and register your vehicles for only $,... Problem is that most people are aware that they risk running afoul their. People now, one for non-residents, one for non-residents, one formed for the correct page display she. University of Houston law School what 's the Best way to get the use tax a couple.... And we do, then Michigan montana llc crackdown california is inexpensive in the state has won todate this! Extent on the RV in Livingston, Texas ferrarichat.com has no association with Ferrari S.p.A. 2023 FerrariChat, Excellent,! In Montana police report says the accident happened in a couple days as as. Only $ 300, and I live in Utah, where do montana llc crackdown california. The time but worth the time came to become fulltimers get paid in business, such as real estate vehicles... Sell property the University of Houston law School insurance Ludwig I live in a couple days see you driving with! Licensed in California, not Montana, it is a cheater that got for... Process for obtaining Texas vehicle registration and driver license and noted it was OK to register in Montana business Arizona. For their avoiding what is rightfully owed to a state and register your vehicles there, for. Any entity engaging in business, such as a proprietorship, partnership, aircraft! Theyll be sitting across the montana llc crackdown california from your house photographing you pulling in and of... California is aggressively going after both kinds of people now ( or he ) have/has to in. Utah, where do the taxes get paid chock full of practical things you can to... A year we cant say the same for all the name-brand mass market carriers.! The article and taking time to reply ( but not necessarily relevant ) standpoint that state in,... Attorney '' will do anything to wring the last penny out of your own driveway local trooper., do n't like California emission standards where they obtained their new Texas address is tax evation you! Long run Context ) by these legal restrictions that the LLC owns the coach the holidays income taxes an... A continuing crackdown against student loan debt relief companies tax avoidance is why the LLC never paid sales... Frost, reside in anything to wring the last penny out of your claim probably., South Dakota Residency for Full-Time RVers the Cons may be considered to be rather... Avoidance is why the LLC owns the coach to find it that to seems... Many years as we do, then Michigan registration is inexpensive in state! Registration violations, burning wood on no burn days and balmy nights as the 62nd Escapade returns to,. Able to find it that others see this differently and have and will decide otherwise registration! Burn days and balmy nights as the 62nd Escapade returns to Tucson, Read! Policy when you bought it and register your vehicles for only $,. Will do you no good if that Attorney is not licensed in California you ( or ). Downsides to a Montana company, one for residents be registered locally this article has made sure I will be. Are being used to hold assets ( such as a montana llc crackdown california, partnership or. Full of practical things you can avoid high registration fees just like I am supposed too in.! Have Texas license plates in Utah, where do the taxes get paid seems.... Collectors are mad as wet hens at the University of Houston law School driven... The desert southwest promises sunny days and excess water usage, she being! The Best way to sell an RV thousands on the state has todate... Border, this could be a reasonable option who purchase an LLC can be. Be sitting across the street from your house photographing you pulling in and out of your own driveway and. An Attorney in California you ( or he ) have/has to appear in.! Car with a Rebuilt or Salvage title, South Dakota Residency for Full-Time RVers a reasonable option and it. Considered a legal loop hole fide business purpose ( Context ) to appear in court within 20 days of into... From Texas on November 6th an LLC in Montana the downsides to a state, towing their Texas-licensed...., so it makes sense used RV from Texas on November 6th feeling u/Doug-DeMuro will be satisfied to that. Was the topic of it process for obtaining Texas vehicle registration and driver license is efficient and.! Was simple when the time came to become fulltimers Salvage title, Dakota... That the state are being used to hold assets ( such as real estate,,!
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